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Talk:Rosa Luxemburg

Talk:Rosa Luxemburg

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Proposal to unmerge luxemburg and luxemburgism[edit]

A friend of mine proposed changes to the former Luxemburgism article earlier this year with the idea in mind that no one practices the tendency. While this is acknowledged to be partially correct, further scholarly review has produced copious evidence for its historical existence in German monographs, articles, etc. (One is directly related to the notion of Luxemburgism in the context of the DDR, where it was used to smear political opponents (much like Trotskyism - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trotskyism): "Rosa Luxemburgs Kritik an Lenin blieb zu ihren Lebzeiten unbekannt. Sie wurde erst 1922 von Paul Levi unter dem Titel Zur russischen Revolution veröffentlicht. Anlass dazu war für ihn zum einen der Beschluss der KPD zur „Offensivstrategie" 1920, den die von Sinowjew geführte Kommunistische Internationale (Komintern) unterstützte, zum anderen der Versuch, die KPD im Kontext des Märzaufstands 1921 zur Abkehr von ihrer Orientierung, durch einen Putsch zur Macht gelangen zu können, zu bewegen und ihre Positionierung gegen die SPD-Linke in Frage zu stellen. Daraufhin schloss die KPD Levi aus. Seine Veröffentlichung trug dazu bei, dass Josef Stalin, die KPdSU, die Kommunistische Partei Deutschlands (KPD)[10] und später die Sozialistische Einheitspartei Deutschlands (SED) [11] Rosa Luxemburgs Positionen später insgesamt als Luxemburgismus abwehrten und verfemten. Von Gegnern des Stalinismus wurden ihre kritischen Passagen dagegen später oft als Inbegriff des Demokratischen Sozialismus zitiert."

The current merged section is called "Thought" on the page for Rosa Luxemburg. The original "Luxemburgism" page that existed needs some key edits, which I am prepared to engage in/with. See also: Von Stefan Steinberg, "Vorgeführt und lächerlich gemacht" Wie die PDS auf die Errichtung einer Statue von Rosa Luxemburg reagiert, [www.wsws.org, 26. Januar 1999, (Online, pdf http://www.wsws.org/de/1999/jan1999/rosa-j26.shtml)


Hoarmurath (talk) 05:08, 7 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Communist books[edit]

Why is the article in this category? Luxemburg herself was not a communist book (though I notice that she wrote several), and this is not a topic category. Geolodus (talk) 07:25, 5 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]

On hating Prussian men[edit]

She despised Prussian men and resented what she saw as the grip of urban capitalism on social democracy.

Needs clarity. Red Society 01 (talk) 20:52, 26 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Execution vs murder[edit]

A number of sources (The Local [1], Deutsche Welle [2] The New European [3] and the Gietinger book) refer to it as a murder. I have replaced execution with murder unless it refers to Pabst's orders. Best, Caius G. (talk) 23:19, 28 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

More sources: Encyclopedia Britannica [4] The Times of Israel [5] and The Conversation (website) [6]. The demonstration has also been described as honouring the "murdered" Luxemburg and Liebknecht [7] (in German). Best, Caius G. (talk) 17:03, 31 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Execution ? ? - Capital punishment, also known as the death penalty, is the state-sanctioned killing of a person as punishment for a crime. The sentence ordering that someone is punished with the death penalty is called a death sentence, and the act of carrying out such a sentence is known as an execution. - Rosa Luxemburg was murdered, not executed. --213.172.123.242 (talk) 08:34, 4 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Do it's an assassination then Mhatopzz (talk) 03:24, 19 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Why is there no "Execution" section?[edit]

There's usually a section detailing how a historical figure died, particularly in cases like Rosa where they were assasinated, executed or otherwise killed. BetweenCupsOfTea (talk) 09:54, 15 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I came here specifically to mention that the circumstances surrounding her death are of historical importance and the details are scattered throughout the article but with no clear description of what is known by history. She was murdered, excecuted, by whom, for what specifically, etc. This is a glaring omission.Calydon (talk) 06:49, 10 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Education[edit]

the gymnasium story is absolutely incorrect. She attended a Polish school, founded by patriotic Polish countess Zyberk-Plater. It was a very prestigious establishment. One of the most expensive schools in the area of Poland occupied by Russian Empire. So it means that her family had means to pay for a very exclusive education. Therefore it signifies her very privileged social position. So there is nothing exceptional in her being Jewish and accepted to the said school, apart from the fact that her father was very wealthy. But this would not sit very well with mythos of Jewish discrimination,. But still I insist that someone would edit the entry accordingly shemyaza

Nationality[edit]

It currently solely lists her nationality as "Polish" in the lede; I propose we change to "Polish-German" or similar, as she had German citizenship and lived much of her life in Germany. I also think we should merge nationality and citizenship in the info box, as the two concepts are usually the same, and list both "Polish" and "German".

I think the current version is appropriate and highly explanatory, especially by the first sentence in the lead section. Oliszydlowski (talk) 03:35, 26 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I disagree; I feel that, as she was primarily known for her actions in Germany, she should be listed as German-Polish; furthermore, nationality and citizenship should be combined, as they synonymous in this case. I did, however, add a note to the lead explaining that she was born in poland and later became a German citizen. --LordNimon (talk) 18:54, 26 April 2021 (UTC)[reply]

She was executed for attempted overthrow of a lawful government[edit]

Wasn't murder, you are twisting words, pathetic. 220.76.183.4 (talk) 08:37, 1 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Sources say that it was murder. 15 (talk) 09:17, 1 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Can't find quote[edit]

The section on the attempted German Revolution has a quote of a speech Luxemburg gave:

Today we can seriously set about destroying capitalism once and for all. Nay, more; not merely are we today in a position to perform this task, nor merely is its performance a duty toward the proletariat, but our solution offers the only means of saving human society from destruction.

This quote has a reference before it attributed to "Nettl, J. P. Rosa Luxemburg. Vol. 1. p. 131. Waters, Mary-Alice Waters (ed.). Rosa Luxemburg Speaks. p. 7.", but I can't find the text in either book. --Ashawley (talk) 17:11, 6 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

"Polish Marxist"[edit]

The fact that this does not follow how reliable sources describe her is that Google Scholar search results in the majority of results using "Polish Marxist" to describe something other than Luxemburg herself. Wikipedia follows WP:RS and therefore this is not a suitable description. The areas she is active in is already described in the next sentence by the political parties she belonged to, so I see this as both redundant and oversimplifying the issue of her nationality. (t · c) buidhe 18:17, 13 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Buidhe: - Perhaps let's avoid the question of nationality and set focus on citizenship or her contributions to socialist movements in Germany (primarily) and Poland (also very significant). I believe it is fair. I have also changed the order in the first sentence description to suit this. Does it sound appropriate? Merangs (talk) 20:15, 13 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Plenty of research has been done about this already - Luksemburg retained her Polish identity and Polish remained her first language, as evidenced by her numerous private letters written in Polish (particularly those to her longtime partner) and her texts on the matters of Germanisation and Russification of Poles under colonial rule. There are many sources that provide proof of this, including plenty of those that are used throughout the article (particularly in the Poland section). Just because someone is forced to flee their country of origin due to political persecution does not mean they cease being part of that culture, in the same way that receiving citizenship in a foreign country through marriage does not mean that one ceases to be a person from their original place of birth and where they spent their formative years. The lead should say that she is a "Polish Marxist", because that is exactly who she was; even during her time in Germany, despite her excellent knowledge of the German language and commitment to internationalism, various people within the SPD continued to see her as an outsider as tends to be the case for migrants. The later sentence, still in the first paragraph, that she was "Born and raised in an assimilated Jewish family in Poland, she became a German citizen in 1897" should be enough for everyone. I understand why Polish nationalists are trying to bury Luksemburg's Polish origin and identity, as to them she is a "traitor" and all that, but I really do not understand what others have to gain from trying to erase her cultural background. --Samotny Wędrowiec (talk) 21:23, 13 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

It's also worth pointing out that Luksemburg was 26 years old when she gained German citizenship. --Samotny Wędrowiec (talk) 18:28, 15 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Retrieved from "https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Rosa_Luxemburg&oldid=1072052154"

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